#PGLBTQ

I figured I’d make an queer discussion thread since we have many of them in the chat box and this way we can save them.

Today’s topic: Astral Frost: One disturbing trend though in LGBT circles is this notion that gays don’t exist. Basically, you’re a repressed pansexual. This is totally asinine.

And Trans people in the media.

I died.

LMFAO I’m glad I clicked this thread. I feel like Astral is being brought up in front of the class at a University lecture hall.

no pressure.

Lol I didn’t think of it like that.

Hey, many of us are use to being the center of attention, whether or not we want to be. :confused:

I have not heard about this “everyone is pansexual trend.” That seems counter to everything we’ve been fighting for, especially letting people being themselves. I’m pansexual, and while I think people should be open to being romantic with anyone, I understand not everyone will be. :slight_smile: This could be the bitter bisexuals who are still angry at people who said they are just repressed gay people. I have heard though that being trans is a trend. But we can’t afford any infighting right now, or ever. That is what the breeders want! We are just getting more visibility in a positive light with all the letters, though we need a stronger bisexual presence.

Is the Astral portion of this class going to be on the test?

If by test you mean STD test, than yes.

[quote=“Sonic”]

STD test[/quote]

I hope it’s a scantron based answer card.

Yeah, I was always good with filling all holes in completely. With my pencil.

We really need a :dead emote for posts like this.

What we need a :dead emote for is every time liquor touches your lips and a keyboard is near. K.

Lol, i like the dug grave with shovel poking out from twitch^

Great idea!

[quote=“Giggler”]

I died.[/quote]

That the thread is all about me? It warms my heart. It means all is right with the world. <3

[quote=“Sonic”]I figured I’d make an queer discussion thread since we have many of them in the chat box and this way we can save them.

Today’s topic: Astral Frost: One disturbing trend though in LGBT circles is this notion that gays don’t exist. Basically, you’re a repressed pansexual. This is totally asinine.

And Trans people in the media.[/quote]

When I said “trend”, I should have said “trend in my radical LGBT circle.” Some of these people even go as far as to say that monogamous relationships are problematic because they’re possessive. They also tend to reject marriage, thinking pursuing equal marriage rights is a mistake because it sends the wrong message and conforms to straight culture. I’m a whole lot more conservative than them.

But anyway, I really am irritated by the notion that I don’t exist. With me, if someone tells me their orientation, what they like, what they don’t, and how they identify, I don’t question it. I take them at face value.

I think Kinsey’s scale makes sense. But while sexuality is fluid, it isn’t for everyone, because I know plenty of gay men who haven’t been even incidentally heterosexual. If I were myself, what reason would I have to deny it? And why would I repress it? I say, take people at their word, even if you suspect otherwise.

I finally find the link that I read in my friend’s facebook feed a while back. It may very well be my worthwhile contribution to a thread I’ve helped derail from the launch. My apologies for that.

It’s basically a girl’s experience that seems to mirror what you were talking about Astral but on the other end of things.

everydayfeminism.com/2015/06/nav … ny-femmes/

Thank you Solomon Grundy and Astral Frost. I’ve read about the radical queers not supporting marriage equality because they want to reject marriage in general. I see where they’re coming from. But the reason to keep marriage is so the government has to recognize people we choose as our family. Thats the whole point. People with no blood relation getting the same rights as those that do.

But you both bring up a sad thing, queer people trying to dictate how others live. To me the whole point is like you said Astral, take people at face value. There are enough straight people who would assume and misjudge things that we don’t need more from our own family. And I can kind of relate to the article, in that I seem to be often attracted to masculine people. Not always of course, I also like tall women, which is one of the few physical traits I will gravitate to. Although I want to go to the lesbian dance at pride to see if any of the women find me attractive.

Great contribution, Grundy. Biphobia in its various forms is a real problem in the gay community.

And persuant to my original complaint, it’s actually important for me to qualify by saying that monosexism is a far larger, more widespread problem than the denial of exclusive homosexuality. Bisexuals catch a lot of hell by those who label all who identify as bisexual as in denial or “on the way” to acceptance of their homosexuality. The idea is that they’re just easing in because it’s easier socially and psychologically. That seems to be the case sometimes, but a lot of people simply like more than one gender.

Sonic, well said, and I agree with you regarding marriage. I think there are a few reasons to make marriage equally available.

  1. On principle. There’s no room to discriminate.

  2. With marriage comes important rights, and there’s no valid legal argument against it. We know this after observing a number of downright embarrassing court challenges.

  3. Some people want it available to them, and it doesn’t hurt anyone to make it available. It has meaning to them culturally and symbolically.

I know they lament what they see as assimilation with straight culture and normative relations, but truly I say unto them…don’t get married. Not everyone wants to pick up the cross of radical social change. Some gays are a whole lot more conservative about this stuff. They want a more traditional relationship, and just because they’re gay, that doesn’t make them beholden to anyone else’s social-political struggles.

To your second point, it’s unfortunate to say but there isn’t nearly the unity we’d like to see in the LGBT community at this point. There are serious problems like hierarchy, monosexism, and transphobia. Just the gay community itself is pretty fractured, what with the cliques and hierarchy ( “no femmes” , outcast of older gays etc).

Which isn’t to say that I don’t have preferences, because I do. I just feel like there’s preferences, and then there’s alienating people from the social fold based on race, age, appearances, etc.

Being bisexual can be rough when dating either sex.

Guys will cut you off mid sentence once they learn you’re bi or some act as though they just met Bigfoot with shock that you really exist then there are some that will just be mean, I literally had a guy laugh and walk away.

As for girls they’re either ok with it or they fear you like you have a disease. Fear or acceptance there really isn’t an in between that I find.

It’s fascinating how a religious act like marriage can have so many legal tie ins and then be denied to people. Religion being something that’s essentially all interpretive. Just looking at all the religions and then all the denominations of each one. Often times each one being claimed and in some cases still claimed to not be the “true” way of worshipping but they’re allowed to exist still.

Eventually I think the people willing to fight the idea of acceptance die or get tired of spending the money to resist it.

Not being LGBT myself I’m certainly not affected as heavily as those that are. But I’m saddened that people think that getting married might be seen as conforming to straight culture. Monogamy is something that’s found in the animal world as is polygamy, humans being one species that you can somewhat easily choose for yourself how you wanna do it. Why limit yourself unnecessarily?

Perhaps it’s the validation of it. If I choose to do something, it does feel better if other people do the same or are in some way in agreeance with it. Even simple shit like say, enjoying a movie. I want everyone to see and hopefully enjoy Mad Max! but honestly some people will hate it and that bums me out a bit when I read the criticisms they have. If they loved it, if everyone did, we could all just celebrate in how much we agree and are right about everything.

Reality is everyone’s different and everyone is right for themselves. But nobody seems okay about it.

[quote=“Omega”]Being bisexual can be rough when dating either sex.

Guys will cut you off mid sentence once they learn you’re bi or some act as though they just met Bigfoot with shock that you really exist then there are some that will just be mean, I literally had a guy laugh and walk away.

As for girls they’re either ok with it or they fear you like you have a disease. Fear or acceptance there really isn’t an in between that I find.[/quote]

Hugs Omega I’m sorry you’ve had to deal with ignorance like that. I haven’t had it as bad, mostly because I don’t really date and my 3 relationships have all been with queer people, who I also believe are all bisexual (not 100% sure about my second relationship). Every time I talk with other LGBT people I’m reminded about how lucky I am because I have not encountered that ignorance on a personal level.

Thank you Astral for the compliment on my point. I was worried that I was too tired that night. Some people think that by wanting marriage equality we want to be just like straight people and not have our own culture. I think marriage is good to have, but I do also think many of us need to show people that the world is not binary. The western world has made many not remember or not know that most cultures had a third space for gender explorers, for those not straight.

I know what you mean Grundy. I equate it to this years E3. Even if you didn’t care about certain games, you should be happy for those that do. Like I don’t really care about FF7, but I’m happy for those that wanted it. Of course I’m sure me getting Shenmue 3 helps.

Speaking of exclusions, what is with the “no fats, no fems, no asians” thing I’ve heard about in the gay male community?

[quote=“Sonic”]

Speaking of exclusions, what is with the “no fats, no fems, no asians” thing I’ve heard about in the gay male community?[/quote]

Everybody is vain, so no fats is self explanatory. Here in America, fat people are discriminated against as much as anyone else. I mean, straight people to. It’s just something about the gay community that makes them all caricatures of themselves and reality and they’re more upfront and mean about it.

The fact that everything is about immediate sex, opposed to the actual person makes it easier to separate yourself from social norms as well. You’re not looking for a mate. You’re looking to bump uglies real quick so they better be sexy as h311.

No fems. Well everybody wants a man. lol which is kind of an oxymoron in and of itself. You’re looking for a MANLY MAN, which sounds like a feminine trait to me.

Like these are who the FEMS are competing with now.

No asians. Simple. Small D%©#$.

You left out “No Blacks” as well. It’s a white man’s world. The ideal gay specimen is a Muscular Tall White Male and it’s the majority what you see. It’s deemed as NORMAL.

You see this in porn, media, culture as a whole. Barbie Dolls.

This is why when black people are in porn it’s EBONY Porn, etc. Not just porn. BET, Ebony magazine. 2nd Class culture. But this is nothing new.

Imagine…Mexican Porn. :uhh (Yeah, I’m a part of the problem, lol)

I just think all these “Preferences” are facades in place of blatant Discrimination and Racism. For some reason it’s okay in the Gay Community though.

[quote=“Sonic”]

Speaking of exclusions, what is with the “no fats, no fems, no asians” thing I’ve heard about in the gay male community?[/quote]

I’m pretty oblivious to that topic, but I’ve never put myself out in the dating scene, nor have I ever been in a romantic relationship, so no surprise there.

By the way, I edited out a much larger portion of my response, mainly because I took way too fucking long to write it, and Giggler summed up a lot of what I was gonna say.